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Author Topic: $52 Million hotel/condo/water park/marina – the next big date January 16, 2006  (Read 2496 times)

Offline Presentation

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I have reviewed a memo from the Oshkosh Director of Community Development about the proposed $52 Million hotel/condo/water park/marina planned for the Marion Road/Pearl Redevelopment Area (includes part of the Mercury Marine plant 24 site) on the North side of the Fox River in Oshksoh, WI. 

If you wish to download a PDF copy of the memo visit my blog then click on the title of this subject at the blog.

The “money” deadline is fast approaching.  Until the money is there its all just talk.

The developer, Five Rivers Development LLC and its President Tom Doig have until January 16, 2006 to secure construction and permanent financing and equity necessary to complete the Phase 1 project, and to provide to the City/RDA conditional commitments for such funding.

Phase I
-condominium-hotel-marina resort complex with 312 units
-an approximate 58,764 square foot conference center
-an indoor/outdoor water feature with approximately 15,289 square feet of indoor space
-food and beverage facilities totaling approximately 16,710 square feet
-a commercial marina with approximately 100 slips
-an associated yacht club
-an approximate 100-space parking area within the main structure
-a 350-400 space surface parking area on the north side of Marion Road.
-approximately 436,356 square feet of building space in a 10 story plus structure.

I personally have been vocal that the local market size dictates the amount of resort, condominium and marina facilities that can succeed.   The current Pioneer Inn marina has the capacity to provide 5 piers yet is unable to fill 4.  Because of this economic reality I feel its unlikely both condominium-hotel-marina resort complex projects will go forward.

So mark January 16th on your calendar.  If funding and the other terms of the agreement between Five Rives and the City of Oshkosh Redevelopment Authority are reached by this deadline you can count on the Phase I of the project going forward with a targeted opening date set for the summer of 2007.  You can also likely count out the Pioneer Inn condominium-hotel-marina resort complex.

Either way we are only weeks away from gaining a better understanding on how the Oshkosh water front landscape will develop. 

« Last Edit: January 03, 2006, 03:53:29 PM by Presentation »
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Offline Downtown42

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wow, tnks for updates

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Offline BoozeCrewz

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I thought I read in the paper that the deadline came and went without the financing being in place...The main problem with the Pioneer not being able to fill all its slips was the unusually high cost against the norm in the area...they relied on the other facilities to justify the extra cost for a slip...It would have cost me an extra $800 a season to slip at the Pioneer vs Slippery buds...or a little over 133 Rum Runners...The facilities for the marina in general are a bit better at slipperys...club house and showers etc...no lake flies but the channel through the pads can be a bummer on windy days...freeway noise vs train noise is about the same...
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Offline Presentation

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...... the deadline came and went without the financing being in place...
 

 
Posted January 19, 2006

Five Rivers still working on finances as city readies TIF

By Alex Hummel
of The Northwestern

The financing behind Oshkosh's $60 million, public-and-private riverfront resort project may not be as solid as city officials had hoped.


Some city leaders thought time was up on Monday for Five Rivers Resort's backers to reveal their financial hand, particularly as the city anted its bid: A nearly $16 million redevelopment loan package.


But as of Wednesday, the city was still seeking more information from Five Rivers Investments LLC about its share of the project's financing.


Whether that should be interpreted as a sign of progress or a reason for concern, and whether Monday marked a firm deadline under an October developers agreement, or just a waypoint, depends upon whom you ask.


On Wednesday, Oshkosh Community Development Director Jackson Kinney told the city's Convention and Visitors Bureau Board that Five Rivers reported some financing details on Monday. But Kinney described the confidential submittal as "not a done deal."


"What they gave us was something to show they are making progress," Kinney told the board.


Some city councilors question whether that meets the requirements of the developer's agreement. Councilor Paul Esslinger called the Five Rivers agreement "quite specific."


"I believe the administration prepared documents that were quite detailed on what had to happen, and this gentleman (Five Rivers Investments President Tom Doig), it sounds like to me, has not met that criteria," Esslinger said. "If you don't meet the criteria for a mortgage, you're going to be in trouble. If we're already at a point where people are not meeting obligations, we need a review."


Meanwhile, the city is pressing on with its end of Five Rivers' financing. Oshkosh's Plan Commission cast a unanimous vote Tuesday blessing a tax-incremental-finance district that will inject a $15.9 million into the Five Rivers' redevelopment area. The plan goes to the city council on Feb. 14.


The condominium-hotel on the Fox River west of Jackson Street would boast more-than 300 units, a 100-slip marina, and a nearly 60,000-square-foot convention center.


Kinney told The Northwestern Wednesday that Monday's deadline was merely a disclosure point. The real deadline Five Rivers faces is a stipulation requiring construction start-up in spring, he said.


"We need to point out that more work needs to be done, and the deadline was really just to give us an idea as to where they were in the process of securing final commitments," Kinney said.


In a statement e-mailed to The Northwestern Wednesday, Doig confirmed that Kinney requested additional information "in both form and content, which we are currently working on."


"Outlined in our submittal, was specific information which focused on the status of our construction financing along with documentation supporting the fact that we currently have several offers and options available for financing," Doig states. "The Five Rivers Team is currently in review of these offers and are still involved in confidential negotiations with potential lenders and equity partners. In light of the magnitude of this project, we believe that our submittal was satisfactory."


In an Oct. 6 memo to city officials, Kinney highlighted key "responsibilities" inside the term sheet including the need for Five Rivers to provide the city with conditional commitments for construction and permanent financing and equity necessary to complete the Phase 1 project" by "no later than January 16, 2006."


On Wednesday, Kinney emphasized the "conditional commitments" phrasing.


However, Councilor Bryan Bain, a project supporter, said he understood Monday's deadline to be firmer than that.


"It was my impression from meeting we had in executive sessions and in workshops that when we voted on the term sheet that (Monday) was a big date – that there were other dates out there, but this was a big date," he said.


Still, he said, a short delay to make sure the city's interests are protected is reasonable.


"A day here, a day there is okay, but if we're talking about following up and re-asking for what we asked for, that's not what I want to see," Bain said. "The reality is we need to make sure we have our interests covered and that we are entering into this under the assumption and protections that the city is going to have a good deal here."


City Councilor Meredith Scheuermann also expressed concern but said "pulling the plug" on the project would be premature.


"I concerned a deadline has gone by and it appears not everything we needed is there. It depends. I don't want to continue making promises until we've got the developers end signed sealed and delivered," Scheuermann said.


Alex Hummel: (920) 426-6669 or ahummel@thenorthwestern.com.



« Last Edit: January 25, 2006, 01:15:06 PM by Presentation »
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Offline Presentation

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OK, so what does all this mean?   

As of right now we still do not have a definite answer on what the Oshkosh riverfront development will be.

At best we went from a firm date of moving forward or not on “January 16th” to “Sometime in spring.”
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Offline Downtown42

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i wanna buy the tiki bar

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Offline BoozeCrewz

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Wouldn't we all...gonna miss that stop, and now I have to find someplace else to get those darned lizards ;D.  I wonder if they really would be interested in leasing that place.  Fratellos just does not make it with me, as of now, there is no other place that I know where you can get a cocktail and music on the lake...except for Waverly Beach, that is a long haul and you have to walk in from your boat.
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Offline Presentation

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On February 15th the Oshkosh Common Council had a closed door meeting with Five Rivers Resort developer Tom Doig.

Well, the Oshkosh WI development with Five Rivers is still unclear but at a maximum we will know if it’s a go by June 21st, the final day the developer has to secure financing. 

At this point, financing is not set.  City councilors are increasingly aware of the challenge Five Rivers developers face in locking in financing by June 21.

After this closed door meeting, Oshkosh Councilor Bryan Bain said “We're really zeroing in on a target here, whether it's 'We're breaking ground' or cutting the fishing line, re-baiting it and recasting for a new fish.”   

The only conclusion we can make is the project becoming reality with the current developer and with the current financing arrangement / time frame is at best a long shot.  Weather it can be pulled back together or announced DOA may not be known until June 21st. 

When asked about the Park Plaza Hotel and convention center just down the river from the proposed resort site, Oshkosh visitors bureau Member John Supple said he feels future hotel development in Oshkosh, including the sale of Park Plaza, is now tied to Five Rivers' future.

"Until the city and Tom Doig decide what's going on, everything's on hold," Supple said. "Nobody will want to invest $3 million in the hotel and then stick a few more million into improvements just to get their butt kicked by Five Rivers."

I feel you can say the same about the Pioneer Inn resort project and the current owner / developer Decade Properties, Inc. 

If the Five Rivers project goes ahead, given the market size, the other two projects simply are not feasible.

I hope the Oshkosh council is aware of how not having an answer on one project is postponing development on others. 
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Offline Presentation

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Warning - long post

Posted March 5, 2006

Five Rivers is drawing skepticism

Michigan leaders warn of similarities

By Jeff Bollier
of The Northwestern


GLADSTONE, Mich. — There's a sign up announcing the future site of Five Rivers Resort.


On Little Bay De Noc, in Gladstone, Mich.


This city of 5,032, five miles north of Escanaba, is where developer Tom Doig first proposed Five Rivers Resort as a 115-unit hotel-condominium hybrid development that included a marina, lodge, tennis courts, swimming area and other amenities.


Though environmental issues doomed the $35 to $50 million Gladstone project in late 2003, city officials interviewed by The Northwestern last week expressed concern about the number of similarities between what Doig proposed in Gladstone and what is currently on the table in Oshkosh.


"I wouldn't want to be the guinea pig for this guy," Gladstone City Manager Brant Kucera said.


Kucera said the deal in Gladstone never progressed as far as it has in Oshkosh, so serious funding questions were never probed. However, he said city leaders were skeptical about the proposal, on matters from the amount of public money sought to the financial backers of the project.


It's been more than a year since Doig unveiled his revamped Five Rivers Resort in Oshkosh. While the city approved a nearly $16 million tax incremental financing district for the project, scrutiny of Doig's ability to find private financial backing has grown.


On Friday, Oshkosh Community Development Director Jackson Kinney recommended the city extend the construction start deadline for Five Rivers from June 20 to Sept. 20 to allow the company time to secure additional private financing. The Oshkosh Common Council is expected to vote on the extension March 14.


That comes as the Winnebago County District Attorney is examining whether the council broke the law by convening a closed-door meeting to discuss the resort with Doig.


On Feb. 14, the city council voted 6-1 to approve the Five Rivers TIF. Later that night, six councilors entered a closed session meeting that began with a small protest from citizens arguing the public-private project no longer justified a closed-door meeting, and that an exemption from state Open Meetings law was illegal.


Two councilors, Meredith Scheuermann and Paul Esslinger, acknowledged last week they signed one-on-one confidentiality agreements with Doig last summer that prevents them from publicly discussing details of their first private meetings with the developer.


Doig on Friday said comparing the Oshkosh and Gladstone projects is like comparing apples and oranges. He said he was working with a different investment group in Gladstone and that state and community development agencies were very enthusiastic about the project before contamination issues came up.


"We had 32 acres of land on a premier piece of property on the bay, so we had double the land at a fraction of the cost," Doig said. "It's not a fair comparison to look at it and compare what funding is necessary in Oshkosh versus what was necessary in Gladstone. The land value was a fraction of the cost of where we're at right now downtown."


City of Gladstone documents reviewed by The Northwestern show Doig said he would bring $20 million of private investment to the project. Even at the low end of the overall project costs, he expected to secure $15 million in public assistance to make Five Rivers there a reality. E-mails between Doig and then-city manager Brian Horst also show the developer hoped public funds would kick-start the project instead of private funding.


"I hate to sound greedy but the truth of the matter is, more money means more and faster progress for the entire project," Doig wrote Horst in a Nov. 6 e-mail. "I think you can imagine that things could move a bit slowly if we were to base all construction on pre-sales (of condominium units). I think that with a little help from you and my marketing efforts, this entire plan could go together quicker than we both think."


In an interview Friday, Doig confirmed that both the Gladstone and the Oshkosh versions of Five Rivers look to public funding sources to start the project and for private investors to carry it through to completion.


On Doig's behalf, the city of Gladstone applied for a $1.7 million in funding from the Michigan Department of Environmental Quality to remediate the brownfield site. Doig also sought other public financing to help pay for a water line to the site and roads from agencies such as the Michigan Economic Development Corp. and the Delta County Economic Development Alliance.


Michigan Economic Development Corp. Upper Peninsula Account Manager Cathi Cole worked with Doig on the public funding that could be available to him for Five Rivers and said she did receive information about Doig's plans for private financing, but declined to release them.


"That's confidential," Cole said. "I don't have any of that information anymore and I really don't want to say."


Doig said the water contamination issues changed Five Rivers from a project that would take a few months to get started to one that would take a few years and that was too long for him. The land was used as a pig iron smelting site from 1905-25 and as a petroleum distribution center in the 1990s.


Gladstone Housing and Zoning Director Howard Haulotte said Cleveland Cliffs Iron Co. and current property owner Citgo, the two businesses that contributed to the site contamination, could never agree on who would pay for what portion of the cleanup effort and that ultimately kept the project from going forward before more-solid details about the project could be requested.


"The cleanup was always someone else's fault," Haulotte said.


In background provided for a public grant for the project, Doig said he had 15 years of residential and industrial real estate experience, but the Michigan proposal was his first commercial development project.


The Gladstone proposal came two years after he left the Cedarburg-headquartered Doig Corporation, Wisconsin's largest pneumatic distributor, where was president until 2001.


Haulotte said there was "a lot of surprise and puzzlement" from Gladstone's citizens and businesses when Doig proposed Five Rivers, but he said the town wasn't exactly holding its breath.


"There was some excitement, but not like you'd expect from a project this big if it was legitimate," Haulotte said. "They could never give us direct answers on anything."


Jeff Bollier: (920) 426-6688 or jbollier@thenorthwestern.com
http://www.thenorthwestern.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060305/OSH03/603050391/1128
« Last Edit: March 05, 2006, 05:30:52 AM by Presentation »
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Offline Presentation

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Posted March 4, 2006

Fall resort deadline suggested

Council to vote on delayed groundbreaking

By Alex Hummel
of The Northwestern


It could be the start of fall, not the end of spring, when shovels turn earth on the proposed $60 million Five Rivers Resort.


However, in return for the extension, city officials want proof that the developer's long-term financing is "secured" by May 31.


On Friday, the city of Oshkosh's director of community development followed up on what Oshkosh Common Council members said they directed during a Feb. 14 closed-door meeting: Scheduling of a March 14 council vote to extend an existing groundbreaking deadline for the condominium-hotel and conference center by three months.


In a memo to city officials Friday, Community Development Director Jackson Kinney said the city council needs to push back a June 20 groundbreaking to no later than Sept. 20, amending project's city-developer "term sheet" and giving developers more time to shore up private financing and equity.


"I don't know that there is as strong a consensus as when the first term sheet was passed that will be present the second time," Councilor Bryan Bain said Friday.


The deadline push-back proposal also comes with a demand that Five Rivers Investments LLC President Tom Doig have "financing for construction of the resort and sufficient equity investment" secured by May 31. Doig would still have until Sept. 20 to lock construction financing – which is contingent on the level of resort-unit pre-sales.


But the city council wants a look-see at the money in hand by May 31.


"While Five Rivers has made progress securing financial commitments for the project, they have indicated they will not meet the time frame in the Term Sheet that called for commencement of construction by Spring, 2006, which essentially meant that construction would have needed to start by no later than June 20, 2006," Kinney states in the memo.


The city's Redevelopment Authority will also be required to consider the term sheet amendment at a March 15 meeting.


The groundbreaking delay request follows almost a month of heightened concern about the public-private redevelopment project, Oshkosh's single largest to date.


On Feb. 14, the city council approved a nearly $16 million tax-incremental finance district enveloping Five Rivers Resort's riverfront parcel. The funds include an up-to $6.4 million loan specifically for the Five Rivers complex, a more than 300-unit condo-hotel with prices now ranging from $108,000 to upwards of $1 million.


The council's "executive session" on Feb. 14 riled citizen protestors who sat-in until asked to leave. They argued the meeting was illegal, not fit for a state Open Meetings law exemption given the city's talks with only one developer. The Winnebago County District Attorney is investigating the meeting's legality.


Two city councilors also told The Northwestern this week that they signed one-on-one confidentiality agreements with Doig in summer 2005 to learn more about the then-conceptual project's amenities and finances.


The groundbreaking deadline extension may also raise questions over the project's actual timetable. Sept. 20 is usually the time of year when contractors ready construction slowdowns, not kickoffs.


"I would like to see them if they are going to wait until September to break ground to work through winter and do what they can, whether it's site prep or planning stages or whatever – let's do something during that time period," Bain said. "But, if it goes through and both sides officially agree to this date, that doesn't mean they have to wait that long, either."


Alex Hummel: (920) 426-6669 or ahummel@thenorthwestern.com.

http://www.thenorthwestern.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060304/OSH0101/603040338/1128
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Offline Presentation

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OK, what does all this mean?

#1) We may not know if the Five Rivers project will go forward or not until September 20th (new date)

#2) Because of this it’s likely the other two potential redevelopment projects, the Pioneer Inn resort ($35 million) and the Park Plaza Hotel and conference remodel ($3 to $5 million – currently bank owned, would need to have someone purchase first) will likely continue to be on hold until a clear and definite answer on the Five Rivers resort project is reached. 
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Offline BoozeCrewz

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Latest from the rumor mill...The newest rumor out there is that even though there have been a few contracts for slips signed by the Pioneer, there may not have been enough for them to open this year.  Of course this is just a rumor, but it comes from a fairly reliable source...Anyone hear anything new from the Pioneer of late?
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Offline Presentation

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Latest from the rumor mill...T there may not have been enough for them to open this year. .....

#1) This is a rumor. 

They will be open.  I get this directly from them.

Year over year (this date last year vs this) they have 18 or about 10% fewer slips rented.

The Milwaukee sport show is just around the corner and the Pioneer normally picks up a dozen or so rentals at this time.

With the new TIFF zone and the river walk the dispute with the DNR is officially resolved. 

#2)  Future plans
The current owner, Decade Properties Inc, is evaluating a different approach then the original construction plans.  One possible plan is to knock down the rest of the building and do it all at once.  Originally they had planed to do this on phases over time.

Stay tuned.   


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Offline BoozeCrewz

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Very good news, I have to admit that I was a bit concerned as this source is usually very reliable.  Having a number of friends that slip at the Pioneer, I am glad they have no worries.  Thanks!
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Offline Presentation

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The developers of the proposed Five Rivers resort have until 4:30 p.m. today to file paperwork showing that they have their end of the financing in order for the proposed $60 million development.

As of right now,  noon, they have not yet filed the paperwork.
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